Fwd this to r' richter and see what he says (I don't have his email)
They're relying on HaRav Elazar shach zt"l:
HaRav Elazar Shach zt"l -- Michtavim U’Mamarimm (Chelek Gimmel, Siman 25), “One who is killed by the nations of the world for the sole reason that he is a Jew is to be considered as if he died Sanctifying Hashem’s name (Al Kiddush Hashem), and our sages (Chazal) said about such a person, “No person has the merit to stand in his/her presence” (Bava Basra 10)” On page 86 of the same volume, HaRav Elazar Menachem Man Shach ZT”l refers to anyone who was killed because he was a Jew with the moniker: Kedoshim This is inferred from the verse, "They have given the corpses of Your servants as food to the birds of the heaven, the flesh of Your pious ones to the beasts of the earth" tehillim 79:2).
Our Sages taught that "your pious ones" refers to the righteous, while "your servants" refers to Jews who were not righteous during their lifetime, but having been murdered by non-Jews, their sins were atoned for thus earning the title "servants" of G-d (Sanhedrin 47). This is the source for the law that even though normally a heretic is not mourned for, if he or she is murdered they are mourned for (Rama, Shach Y.D. 340:5). It is not customary to mourn for a habitual sinner and certainly not an idol worshipper.... When such sinners are murdered by gentiles the mourning rituals are observed (Yoreh Deah 340:5).
Fwd this to r' richter and see what he says (I don't have his email)
ReplyDeleteThey're relying on HaRav Elazar shach zt"l:
HaRav Elazar Shach zt"l -- Michtavim U’Mamarimm (Chelek Gimmel, Siman 25), “One who is killed by the nations of the world for the sole reason that he is a Jew is to be considered as if he died Sanctifying Hashem’s name (Al Kiddush Hashem), and our sages (Chazal) said about such a person, “No person has the merit to stand in his/her presence” (Bava Basra 10)”
On page 86 of the same volume, HaRav Elazar Menachem Man Shach ZT”l refers to anyone who was killed because he was a Jew with the moniker: Kedoshim
This is inferred from the verse, "They have given the corpses of Your servants as food to the birds of the heaven, the flesh of Your pious ones to the beasts of the earth" tehillim 79:2).
Our Sages taught that "your pious ones" refers to the righteous, while "your servants" refers to Jews who were not righteous during their lifetime, but having been murdered by non-Jews, their sins were atoned for thus earning the title "servants" of G-d (Sanhedrin 47). This is the source for the law that even though normally a heretic is not mourned for, if he or she is murdered they are mourned for (Rama, Shach Y.D. 340:5). It is not customary to mourn for a habitual sinner and certainly not an idol worshipper.... When such sinners are murdered by gentiles the mourning rituals are observed (Yoreh Deah 340:5).
Rav Richter has responded per the following...
Delete1) I admire somebody who takes time to ask questions.
2) Did you listen to the class? Because this was the first point discussed at length.
3) I mentioned at the beginning of the class to listen to both parts before asking questions. Rav Schach was in the second part. Kol tuv.